Thursday TT

[cath]

Judging by some of the emails I've had both from the weekly updates and the Spoco series last year, there is a definite feeling among sections of the membership that 'I've paid my membership fee so I expect things to be provided for me' (and I'm not pointing the finger at anyone specifically by the way).

Well it needs saying: that's not how it is! the people who organise events/lead rides/send out membership cards/sort out club kit...and all the thousand other jobs also pay their membership fee, it's just that they are prepared to give up some of their time to make Clifton CC function. Now, not everyone has either the time or inclination to take on an official job and thats absolutely fine - but giving a bit back to enable Clifton to keep functioning ain't much to ask, is it? one evening a year to stand on a corner? big deal.

And as for paying people to marshal - why should we? the organisers, timekeepers and all the other people doing the jobs listed above don't get paid do they? At the end of the day, Clifton is run by it's members and if the wider membership isn't interested in having so many competitive events than perhaps we need to think about scaling back what we do to match what people actually want.

I don't want that - I'd like to see us doing more stuff, but maybe I'm in a minority now.

FInally - Will, the comment you made that wound me up is

If I started them earlier then I'd happily marshal after doing 5 events

- why should it matter how many events you ride? most of the marshals haven't actually ridden any - they just want to support the Club.

[willhub]

Will, the comment you made that wound me up is

If I started them earlier then I'd happily marshal after doing 5 events

- why should it matter how many events you ride? most of the marshals haven't actually ridden any - they just want to support the Club.

I really don't see how that can wind people up, it's not throwing insults or dissing the club.

[PhilBixby]

PM sent...

[Dr Dave]

And as for paying people to marshal - why should we? the organisers, timekeepers and all the other people doing the jobs listed above don't get paid do they?

Assuming this is addressed to me ( I did say I knew this wouldn't be an idea that would thrill everyone ) of course the 'expenses' would accrue to all those who gave up their time , not just marshals....

As to the 'why should we' - my answer would be that if the present system isn't working ( less events this year, still having to cancel) then at least consider alternative ideas. Sure they may not all prove to be successful but if ideas are just dissed out of hand it hardly encourages 'innovative collaborative solutions'...

[MichaelCarter]

I've had a few constructive pm and email chats about taking the web thing forward, if anyone wants me to include them in the emails / has any suggestions please email me at Mcarter@yorkcollege.ac.uk

Michael

[Tullio]

I think Dave's point is very valid. At the extreme we could commute our status from 'Voluntary Organisation' to 'plc'.

Each event would either be run by 'staff' paid a salary, expenses and receive a (not too) generous pension and paid holidays, or outsourced. In return 'members' become 'customers' with a contract from Clifton plc guaranteeing levels of service, none of this cancelled events lark.

The Committee would all be replaced (bunch of amateurs anyway) with a Board of Directors which we'd employ a headhunter to search, select and appoint prior to an IPO next fiscal.

Charging will be simply pay and play. Staff will be on hand with card machines at each event which will print out your entry ticket. Season tickets will also be available.

Might work out a little more expensive but everyone will be happier in the long run.

[Jason]

I wonder if the success of the TT series is also its failing. With 40 people riding each week, it’s easy to look around and assume that “some of the other 39 will volunteer next week”. But if everyone thinks like this, no one volunteers and there’s no event…

There have been some good solutions offered, but at the risk of confusing matters further, here’s mine (which with hindsight isn't far from what Mark proposed back on page 1).

For each event, a certain number of places are reserved for people who have already volunteered or who have firmly committed to volunteer (accepting that home / work / family emergencies might intervene). The number of reserved spaces is open for discussion – you might say that all 40 spaces should be reserved as I’m sure that the series requires more than 40 individual volunteer duties. Once the reserved spaces for any given evening have been taken, then the remaining spaces are opened up on a first-come first-served basis.

You might decide that the “volunteering” qualification extends beyond volunteering for the TT series, to take account of the other volunteering activities – the City Centre Races etc. This will give those in the same position as Dr Dave (unable to commit to a specific date due to work constraints) the opportunity to take part.

So essentially we’re taking the emphasis away from having to volunteer in order to qualify for the series awards (which for lots of riders are out of reach – that’s a different discussion for a different day) to having to volunteer (or commit to volunteer) in order to guarantee a ride.

Finally, let’s remember that this is a public forum and that on our homepage we say “we aim to be friendly and approachable…”. I know that this is a subject that we shouldn't dodge, but I’m also sure we don’t want to inadvertently put off potential future members who happen to be popping in to see what we’re like…

Jason.

[Cyan Skymoos]

I say drop the flat 10, it needs the most helpers, but everyone wants to ride it because its the easiest.
If you have to have a flat TT replace it with an out and back which doesn't need as many helpers.

[Dr Dave]

I think Dave's point is very valid. At the extreme we could commute our status from 'Voluntary Organisation' to 'plc'.

Each event would either be run by 'staff' paid a salary, expenses and receive a (not too) generous pension and paid holidays, or outsourced. In return 'members' become 'customers' with a contract from Clifton plc guaranteeing levels of service, none of this cancelled events lark.

The Committee would all be replaced (bunch of amateurs anyway) with a Board of Directors which we'd employ a headhunter to search, select and appoint prior to an IPO next fiscal.

Charging will be simply pay and play. Staff will be on hand with card machines at each event which will print out your entry ticket. Season tickets will also be available.

Might work out a little more expensive but everyone will be happier in the long run.

Reductio ad absurdum at it's finest Paul

[Andy J]

Why not make it compulsary for members to help out a one event per year? other clubs in the area do it. Yorkshire Velo for example run 2 open time trials a year and as a member you are expected to help at one of these two events, this is clearly stated on there clubs membership form. In addition if you ride the taddy thursday evening league then on the thursdays its YV's turn to organise then everyone who rides this league helps run the event unless they have a good reason not too. We have approx 10 of our club members riding this league and we run three of the league events each summer, so those who ride, commit to be there to help otherwise we could not participate as an affilated club to this league. You maybe think thats only three events? but thats also only 10 people putting on three events for 40 other riders.

I know in the grand scheme of things this affair is none of my business with not being a paid up member this year, but felt an insight into how another club in the area deals with a problem similar to the one you face maybe of interrest to you at this time.

Kind Regards

Andy